Poll ...... Keep Frank Reich or Fire Him

[Colts And Orioles]

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This was albany ed's idea ...... the same albany ed who has eloquently pointed out on numerous occasions that success has many fathers, but failure is an orphan. ) ) An excellent example of that philosophy is when the Colts went for it on 4th down late in the 2nd quarter, and scored a touchdown. Even though it worked, I did not like that decision ........ and I suspect that whatever criticism that Reich is currently getting would be tenfold if the Buccaneers' defense had stopped the Colts on that 4th down play.

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[rm1369]

Originally Posted by Colts And Orioles

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........ and I suspect that whatever criticism that Reich is currently getting would be tenfold if the Buccaneers' defense had stopped the Colts on that 4th down play.

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You are absolutely correct - he’d be getting killed even more. But the colts D gave up 31 points in the last 6 possessions by TB. I think Frank has to be aggressive offensively because, unless aided by weather, the D is going to fall apart. It happens pretty damn consistently.

[Spike]

No brainer, keep Frank Reich.

[Colts And Orioles]

Originally Posted by rm1369

You are absolutely correct - he’d be getting killed even more. But the Colts' D gave up 31 points in the last 6 possessions by TB. I think Frank has to be aggressive offensively because, unless aided by weather, the D is going to fall apart. It happens pretty damn consistently.

o


How much more aggressive can Reich be than going for it on 4th and goal the from opponents' 4 yard-line with less than 2 minutes to play in the first half ??? Or by calling for a pass on 27 consecutive plays from scrimmage, including the times in which Wentz scrambled out of the pocket to run and/or fumbled the ball when he was sacked ???

I understand what you are saying about trying to overcompensate for the defense, and the first thing that comes to mind is when Dan Marino had to try and out-gun his awful Dolphins defense between 1986 and 1989 ...... but if the offense turns the ball over 3 or 4 times in a game, there really isn't much that the offense can do to compensate for its own failures. The defense was put into bad a bad position by the offense (and the special teams) on numerous occasions when they turned the ball over on multiple occasions throughout the Buccaneers game, turnovers that shifted the momentum of the game greatly.

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[Oldcolt]

Isn't a person alive I agree 100% with, including myself (I do change my mind). I have disagreed with him on quite a lot of things. Don't like going away from the run is number one. I am not crazy about all this going for it on 4th all the time. Yet this man has the qualities that are rare in a human being. He is honest, cares about people as people and is definitely someone I can root for. Who else would you bring in? We have been drafting for 4 years (don't count the first) with what Reich/Ballard both have in mind. We have a QB that needs Reich to be successful (at least I wouldn't want to chance it with another coach). Reich stays. We have gotten away from our identity a little, I expect that to change in the next run of games. Who knows what this year will bring if we do, could be a Lombardi!!!

[ChoppedWood]

Originally Posted by Oldcolt

Isn't a person alive I agree 100% with, including myself (I do change my mind). I have disagreed with him on quite a lot of things. Don't like going away from the run is number one. I am not crazy about all this going for it on 4th all the time. Yet this man has the qualities that are rare in a human being. He is honest, cares about people as people and is definitely someone I can root for. Who else would you bring in? We have been drafting for 4 years (don't count the first) with what Reich/Ballard both have in mind. We have a QB that needs Reich to be successful (at least I wouldn't want to chance it with another coach). Reich stays. We have gotten away from our identity a little, I expect that to change in the next run of games. Who knows what this year will bring if we do, could be a Lombardi!!!

But isn't the problem that our identity has become HIM? I don't know that he has the aptitude to revert back to something else. We'll see I suppose.

[rm1369]

Originally Posted by Colts And Orioles

o


How much more aggressive can Reich be than going for it on 4th and goal the from opponents' 4 yard-line with less than 2 minutes to play in the first half ??? Or by calling for a pass on 27 consecutive plays from scrimmage, including the times in which Wentz scrambled out of the pocket to run and/or fumbled the ball when he was sacked ???

I understand what you are saying about trying to overcompensate for the defense, and the first thing that comes to mind is when Dan Marino had to try and out-gun his awful Dolphins defense between 1986 and 1989 ...... but if the offense turns the ball over 3 or 4 times in a game, there really isn't much that the offense can do to compensate for its own failures. The defense was put into bad a bad position by the offense (and the special teams) on numerous occasions when they turned the ball over on multiple occasions throughout the Buccaneers game, turnovers that shifted the momentum of the game greatly.

o

I’m not suggesting he needs to be more aggressive, I’m saying it is very likely a big factor in his decision making. And one that I agree with.

I see two issues with your argument. One is that you are putting the turnovers on Franks play calling. I definitely disagree. The sack / fumble maybe. I don’t really agree, but ok. Pascals fumble? Hines fumble? The first interception? No I don’t think there was anything wrong with those play calls. It was all execution.

The second issue is you are wrong on the offense putting the defense in holes in the TB game. I’ve posted it, but go look at the drive lengths in the TB touchdowns. There are no 30 yd TD drives. No 40 yarders. No 50 yarders. The shortest one was 65 yards - 10 yards less than a touchback. Against Baltimore the shortest TD drive was 68 yds. It’s just an inaccurate statement.

I just still find it strange that the Colts rank as one of the top offenses and a mediocre / bad defense (except takeaways), yet everyone wants to put the failures on the offensive play calling.

[ChoppedWood]

Originally Posted by rm1369

I’m not suggesting he needs to be more aggressive, I’m saying it is very likely a big factor in his decision making. And one that I agree with.

I see two issues with your argument. One is that you are putting the turnovers on Franks play calling. I definitely disagree. The sack / fumble maybe. I don’t really agree, but ok. Pascals fumble? Hines fumble? The first interception? No I don’t think there was anything wrong with those play calls. It was all execution.

The second issue is you are wrong on the offense putting the defense in holes in the TB game. I’ve posted it, but go look at the drive lengths in the TB touchdowns. There are no 30 yd TD drives. No 40 yarders. No 50 yarders. The shortest one was 65 yards - 10 yards less than a touchback. Against Baltimore the shortest TD drive was 68 yds. It’s just an inaccurate statement.

I just still find it strange that the Colts rank as one of the top offenses and a mediocre / bad defense (except takeaways), yet everyone wants to put the failures on the offensive play calling.

This is a good post, and your last statement is exactly why I voted FIRE in the poll, and I realize I will be joined by few if any.

Your post is spot on, routinely this defense gives up sustained drive after sustained drive, and it actually seems as though the plan is as simple as "Darius go make a play". This isn't a this year / injuries / thing. This is a consistent pattern that happens essentially every single game. Yet, what do we do, the same damn thing we do - soft zone, huge bubble in the middle of the field with a blitz maybe like 3 times a game. At some point- as the HC, it's your job to say enough, that has to stop. And yes, I am aware Ebersuck wasn't brought here by Frank, doesn't matter, at this point he is held accountable as the HC of this team and if he wasn't satisfied with this he would have made a change or at least told Ballard to stand on his guy and do something different.

[Colts And Orioles]

Originally Posted by rm1369

I’m not suggesting he needs to be more aggressive, I’m saying it is very likely a big factor in his decision making. And one that I agree with.

I see two issues with your argument. One is that you are putting the turnovers on Franks play calling. I definitely disagree. The sack / fumble maybe. I don’t really agree, but ok. Pascals fumble? Hines fumble? The first interception? No I don’t think there was anything wrong with those play calls. It was all execution.

The second issue is you are wrong on the offense putting the defense in holes in the TB game. I’ve posted it, but go look at the drive lengths in the TB touchdowns. There are no 30 yd TD drives. No 40 yarders. No 50 yarders. The shortest one was 65 yards - 10 yards less than a touchback. Against Baltimore the shortest TD drive was 68 yds. It’s just an inaccurate statement.

I just still find it strange that the Colts rank as one of the top offenses and a mediocre / bad defense (except takeaways), yet everyone wants to put the failures on the offensive play calling.

o


I am not putting the turnovers on Frank's play-calling. I don't know where you got that idea. I am putting the turnovers on the players (both on offense and the special teams.) My critique was of the turnovers themselves, not that of Reich's play-calling. You said that Frank needs to be aggressive on offense, and I pointed out that Reich was about as aggressive as he could be on offense ..... although, I admittedly misunderstood you when I thought that you were suggesting that he be more aggressive than he already was.

Regarding the turnovers, your point is taken as to where they turned the ball over on the field, but any kind of turnover almost always affects the position that the defense is put in. The first is the obvious ...... turning the ball over deep in your own territory immediately puts the opponent in chip-shot field goal range and/or touchdown range. But even if you turn the ball over while you are deep in your opponents' territory, that affects the defense too in that it takes sure points off of the board. It doesn't affect the defense as much as turning it over deep in your own territory, but the score of the game does affect not only the defense, but the team overall ...... the other side of that same coin would be in some of the years in which Peyton Manning played, when he and the Colts' offense would get an early lead that would allow Freeney, Mathis, and company to tee off on the opposing offenses. The cushion/lead that the team had allowed the defense to take more chances and be more aggressive. The defense needs to be judged on its play first and foremost, but the score of the game (including taking sure points off of the board by turning the ball over when you have at least a field goal in your pocket) affects the defense also, albeit to a lesser degree.


So perhaps we are more in agreement than I initially thought in the first place, or as you thought so in the second place.

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[rm1369]

Originally Posted by Colts And Orioles

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So perhaps we are more in agreement than I initially thought in the first place, or as you thought so in the second place.

o

Yeah, sorry - sounds like I misunderstood your statements.