Tagging Jones and signing Pierce
 

I see a lot of people in the media are arguing that Ballard got it wrong, that he should have tagged Pierce and let Jones dangle his toes in free agency. The premise is that Jones, coming off an injury plagued season would ply his goods, learn that teams didn’t value him as highly as he valued himself, then slunk back to Indy, chastised, tail between his legs.

Personally, I think Ballard got it right, but I’m interested in what the rest of you think.

I think that, if you don’t have a Quarterback, you don’t have anything. I think that, even with the injuries, Daniel Jones would have been the hottest name in free agency. If he had awakened this morning as a free agent, he would have been packing his bags, this afternoon.

Someone would have offered up a mega million dollar contract, and no one from his camp would have bothered with the courtesy of inquiring whether the Colts might match it. In the NFL, teams don’t do the dirty work of negotiating contracts for other teams. When they negotiate with a free agent and reach a deal, they expect him to sign on the bottom line.

That’s why it’s unlikely that Jones gains much traction in free agent talks with other teams. 31 teams know that, whatever the final number turns out to be, Ballard will suck it up and match.

At this exact moment, it’s impossible to know just what these deals mean in terms of the cap. We presume, but don’t know that Jones will ink a new contract. We don’t know how Pierce’s deal is structured, what his first year cap number will be.

Right now, after trading Pittman, they’re $23 Million, and change, under the cap. That will, of course, change when Pierce’s number emerges from the mist.

That having been said, it’s hard to see much how advantage could have been gained from prioritizing Pierce. His new contract’s average annual value is $28.5 Million. The cost of tagging him would have been right around that number, so its a wash. Hanging the transition tag on Jones, however, might have saved us a bundle…depending on how it plays out. At the very most, we’re on the hook for $37 Million and change. Without the certainty of his return, Ballard, facing a hard deadline, might have caved and met his agent’s demand of $50 Million.

There was no ‘good’ move as far as the Colts are concerned. What you say is true but it is also true that the team that was going to offer him mega millions can still do so and hamstring us financially if we decide to match. This is a bed that Ballard made.

Signing Jones was always going to hamstring us, financially. .it’s a price you pay for having a Quarterback worth more than a bucket of warm spit.

In the last ten years, no player tagged with the transition has changed teams. Only one, Kyle Fuller, even received an offer from another club.

As far as this being a bed Ballard made, a dozen other General Managers would love to hop into that bed.

Agreed. I just don't think it is a compliment to say he is better than 12 out of 32 general managers in the NFL. To me you made my point

A dozen GM’s already have their guy. Brett Veach, in KC doesn’t need a Quarterback. Twenty would love to have Jones, but most don’t have the cap space to pursue. They’re stuck in Quarterback purgatory, shuffling from Kyler Murray to Tua Tagavailoa to Joe Flacco.

Just how good Ballard is is a question that’ll play out over the next few seasons. He finally has a Quarterback, and the test will be how well he juggles the cap and adds enough talent to propel the team into legit Super Bowl contention.

Man, can we move the goal posts any further for this guy? Plenty of GMs have QB issues. Ballard was screwed by thinking he had a HOF caliber QB on the roster, but after a season or two he’s been in no different position than the majority of GMs. It’s his philosophy that has put the team in the position it’s been in. Nothing else. Both teams in the SB went from HOF QBs to no QB to the SB in less time that Ballard has had. So what we start the clock for Ballard now to determine if he’s good? For him and him only nearly a decade of mediocrity means nothing? I swear the man is teflon. I can’t wait to hear next year’s excuses.

I don’t have to move the goalposts any farther than the 8-2 record the day Jones got hurt. Ballard assembled a team that was loaded with talent but couldn’t overcome a double barreled disaster at Quarterback.

Philosophy has nothing to do with his inability to find an upper echelon Quarterback. Most successful GM’s stumble onto one, then get labeled a genius because luck gobsmacked them in the face like a lemon meringue pie in a Three Stooges short.

If Andrew Luck hadn’t retired or if Patrick Mahomes had been taking snaps from Ryan Kelly, there would be a couple more shiny Lombardi Trophies on the team’s mantlepiece. Instead, we’ve been in a position where we’ve shuffled from one nonentity to another.

And, yeah, the Patsies and the Seahags rebounded from oblivion to glory. But, they didn’t do it with Matt Ryan or Joe Flacco at the helm. They didn’t do it starting their third string QB.

The pinnacle of success after 9 years - a stretch going 8-2 yet still missing the playoffs. Maybe we should hang a banner. We’ll see what the new excuse is.

It’s funny how many other teams have found more success than Ballard’s teams. In your mind he has somehow, through no fault of his own, been unusually restricted at the QB position. While other teams are lucky, Ballard is skilled but ohh so unlucky. I’m very curious, since it wasn’t Ballards philosophy that led to Minschew, Flacco, Wentz, and Ryan, what is it that you think led to them being QBs for the Colts? I’ve said before if it’s all luck then why do you want such an unlucky GM controlling everything?

The Rams got pretty damn lucky too. And let’s add SF and TB to the list of teams successfully replacing QBs very recently. Hell for fun I’ll go through how many teams have made the playoffs after changing QBs since Lucks retirement. We already have two SB winners. Bet there have been quite a few playoff teams. All of them I’m sure got lucky or experienced some degree of difficulty beyond what Ballard has though. Right? Shit edited to add Denver. So all 4 teams in the conference finals this year have replaced QBs in less time than Ballard has had. And I’m sure you have an excuse for each one.

I agree that Ballard played it the right way. I had concerns; I was wrong. A glass half full attitude can be a powerful thing.

What's the threshold for these dudes keeping their jobs? Is a wild card berth sufficient? Does it need to be a division title and home playoff game? Does it need to be 1 playoff game victory? Does it need to be a deep run?

Given the history of this organization the last decade, combined with Jones' full history in addition with his half season last year, what's the most likely outcome for the Indianapolis Colts?

Ballard's strategy here appears to have been sound but I can't even start to think about another cycle of 3-4 years with that guy until something changes in a meaningful way. IMO he only has 1 year to accomplish that, with a QB that historically is questionable and has genuine durability issues.

Originally, I was dead set against tagging Jones and risk losing Pierce to free agency. I say this without insider knowledge. Maybe Jones was firm on a huge guaranteed multi year contract, maybe Pierce stated that he wanted to remain a Colts and if they offered a decent contract, he'd sign it. Since they have both players for next season, I have to say I was wrong about how Ballard handled it. I didn't think they'd keep Pierce once they tagged Jones. Jones IMO is still a question mark. He never had enough games against quality opponents to convince me he's the real deal. Add to that his injury, and he's a big risk. There's a couple of QBs that you could have gotten for a song, since their previous team is on the hook for millions. I really don't believe there would have been huge competition for Jones, but that's only my opinion. I don't like losing Pittman, but if they couldn't get him to swing a cap friendly deal, he had to go. I still have a soft spot for AR, he's probably a bust, but dam, if he could turn it around, the Colts would be in QB heaven.

With a healthy Jones last year. I think we beat the Jags and Texans at least once, maybe even sweep one of them.

Yes, a few teams found a Quarterback then achieved greater success than the Colts. Cincinnati found Joe Burrow, Buffalo found Josh Allen, Chicago got Caleb Williams. But, I think you underestimate the years, the decades, of futility that preceded the moment they snagged their golden ticket..

Between the day that Jon Gruden hoisted the Lombardi Trophy untl Tom Brady brought them another, the Buccaneers had 5 winning seasons in 17 years. At Quarterback, they shuffled from Johnson to Simms, from Griese to Gradkowski, from Rattay to Garcia, McCown to Leftwich. From Freeman to Johnson to Glennon to Winston, and Fitzpatrick.

Same story in the bay area. In the 16 years before Jimmy Garaffolo came along, the 9’ers made the playoffs 3 times.

In the quarter century before Joe Burrow arrived in Cincinnati, they managed four division titles.

From 1996 until 2020, Buffalo was the poster child for futility.

Heck, any Colt fan should be able to attest to the difficulty of winning without a QB. Between Bert Jones and Peyton Manning yawned a gulf of frustration. I won’t provide a list, but names like Gary Hogeboom, Mike Pagel, and Marty Domres populate my nightmares.

The bottom line is that Quarterbacks, at least good ones, don’t grow on trees. Finding one is like fishing in a septic tank. 9 out of 10 times, you reel in a turd; but, every once in awhile, you cast your line and hook Tom Brady.

Chris Ballard and the Irsay sisters obviously thing that they pulled the handle on the slot machine and it turned up all cherries. If they did, then a decade of dappled sunlight and fields of wildflowers stretch before us. Summer in Westeros. But if they’re wrong, Chris Ballard will find himself in the midst of winter, on the wrong side of the wall, pursued by slavering white walkers.

Apparently the key to being a GM is simply blind luck at QB? Can’t find a QB, you are not bad, just unlucky. Find a QB and you aren’t good, you are just lucky. The rest of the roster is irrelevant until you get lucky and find a QB. I’m curious why Ballard would be fired if DJ isn’t the QB they think. Isn’t that just him being unlucky? Again. Is DE similar? And was Ballard a genius for drafting Raimann or was that just luck? Over the years I’ve learned that for any bad decision Ballard makes it’s bad luck or someone else’s fault. And any good decision is an example of his genius.

To be serious here, I’m well aware of the worst case scenarios and teams that have struggled to find QBs over long stretches. I remember Gary Hogeboom, Mike Pagel, Chris Chandler, Jack Trudeau. And I’ll also tell you, those were mostly poorly ran teams besides lacking at QB. And that’s true of many of the other teams. Those that weren’t poorly ran put together short peaks. Like a Rex Grossman getting to the SB. Or the 49ers three playoff appearances you gloss over - 2 NFC finals losses and a SB loss, with two different QBs (Smith and Kapernick). Ballard has been in the worst division in football and hasn’t won it. And he hasn’t been facing Mahomes, Allen, or Lamar in the division either. He can’t beat the Titans, Texans, and Jaguars. Actually well ran franchises perform better than the Colts have in Ballard’s tenure - even without the super star QB.

I’m not disregarding how difficult it can be to find a competent QB. I’m not someone who believes Ballard sucks because he didn’t find the next Josh Allen in two seasons. I am saying that his overall philosophy sucks and leads to what we have seen. Both his philosophy for finding a QB and for building the roster. I can see why you agree with his philosophy though - it matches what you apparently believe about the position, that it’s nothing but luck. No need to identify and go get your guy (like a Stafford), just churn through enough guys until you get lucky and one sticks. I hope DJ is the guy. I’m admittedly skeptical. Just remember if he is that it’s just Ballard getting lucky, nothing more.

To paraphrase Finch fromTKAM, people usually find what they are looking for. Some look for reasons to hate on Ballard. Others look for reasons to believe he can get it done. We know who is who, so why quibble on it any longer.

Colts + ASoIaF = Win!

I’d say his record and accomplishments after 9 years indicates his ability to get it done, but fair enough. I’ve said retaining him this year made sense after the Sauce trade. I just get tired of the crying for how unfair things have been for him. Plenty of GMs have needed QBs and nearly all have done more than Ballard or lost their jobs. He’s not unlucky, he’s mediocre.

Ballard cannot draft QBs, defensive backs or defensive lineman to safe his soul. Our three best defensive players were not drafted by us buy either traded for or were free agents. For a man who people seem to think is a genius at drafting he is really just mediocre the last half decade or so. Maybe Latu can turn into a player that can take over a game but so far not. The Colts record speaks for itself. We are bringing back essentially the same team as last year so far but expect way different results. I hope we shock everyone, including me.

My favorite nightmare was Curtis Painter coached by catfish Caldwell and under that idiot Grigson. Enough to make a person wanna cut their wrists!!! :D

o


Captain Comeback wasn't too shabby.

o

Those three never intersected.

Evan Sidery
@esidery
·
22m
The Colts structured Daniel Jones’ contract where they can easily get out of it after next season, if necessary.

If Indianapolis moved on from Jones with a post-June 1 designation, they would save $38 million while only incurring an $8.8 million dead cap charge in 2027.

GM Chris Ballard and head coach Shane Steichen both enter next season on the hot seat, too.

Unless I am having a senior moment....http://www.nfl.com/news/caldwell-pai...000d5d819d43be

I believe Grigson was at the helm at this time but perhaps my memory is failing me.

I believe he's drafted exactly 1 QB in the first 3 rounds of the draft. Not only that, but there is cluttered evidence that suggests that Richardson was an Irsay/Morocco Brown pick. So Jacob Eason and Sam Ehlinger don't mean shit. There were not any expectations as to what those two would become.

I also believe that Irsay orchestrated the naming of AR5 as the starting QB after 1 week of training camp.

Now, if you wanna argue that Ballard could've swung for the fences and moved up in the draft to get an elite talent...that I can agree with.